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Old 09-07-2013, 07:21 PM   #21
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You'll need a FAST intake to hit the 500 mark with cathedral port heads, out of an LS1 which is a challenge in itself from a 5.7. You'll need heads that will flow, with bigger valves, cathedral port are limited to how much you can open them. A set of LS3 square port heads will free that up, but still need work. A good size cam as well .620+ lift, a lot of duration. At that point, fly cutting will be a MUST.

We've done a LOT of LS power cars, knowing what works and what doesn't took us a lot of trial and error too.
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Old 09-07-2013, 08:17 PM   #22
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Ehhhh... Not necessarily true. Bigger flowing heads are great for FI and strokers. However, the proven 346ci(ls1/6) head setup is the trick flow 215s, obviously some custom milling or if you want that big lopy cam leave them as they come. The nice thing about bumping compression over a big stick is the muuuuuch better drivability and the hard hitting torque and super quick revs. This is key especially in a stick car and anything you want to tear up some curves in.
Yes, a FAST intake/tb setup will flow, however stick with the sub 102mm as that's just too big for stock cubes. These smaller n/a motors need VELOCITY over pure flow when it comes to heads/intake setup. The other thing you want to look at is how much extra supporting mods are you wanting to throw at it? 400whp can be done very easily/safely with just small fuel mods(injectors/tune). Stock hotwired pump is fine and stock lines/rails. However once you start pushing up the power you'll be diving into deeper and deeper supporting mods. Built trans,driveshaft,rear end, lots of fuel, etc. if this is going to be daily driven as you stated, I think that you will be plenty happy with a higher compression smaller cam(.595ish lift 23x duration) as this retains drivability and won't be quite so lopy. Remember the best part of these motors is the instant torque, more compression=quicker/bigger torque throughout te band, where as those big ol cams move the torque/hp up the revs ALOT. Which is great at the strip, but can be a pain on the street.

Texas speed is great, but also check out vengeance racing. They have a ton of ls experience as well and great service. I'd also spend some time over on ls1tech and do some more research there
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:59 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by owndjoo View Post
Ehhhh... Not necessarily true. Bigger flowing heads are great for FI and strokers. However, the proven 346ci(ls1/6) head setup is the trick flow 215s, obviously some custom milling or if you want that big lopy cam leave them as they come. The nice thing about bumping compression over a big stick is the muuuuuch better drivability and the hard hitting torque and super quick revs. This is key especially in a stick car and anything you want to tear up some curves in.
Yes, a FAST intake/tb setup will flow, however stick with the sub 102mm as that's just too big for stock cubes. These smaller n/a motors need VELOCITY over pure flow when it comes to heads/intake setup. The other thing you want to look at is how much extra supporting mods are you wanting to throw at it? 400whp can be done very easily/safely with just small fuel mods(injectors/tune). Stock hotwired pump is fine and stock lines/rails. However once you start pushing up the power you'll be diving into deeper and deeper supporting mods. Built trans,driveshaft,rear end, lots of fuel, etc. if this is going to be daily driven as you stated, I think that you will be plenty happy with a higher compression smaller cam(.595ish lift 23x duration) as this retains drivability and won't be quite so lopy. Remember the best part of these motors is the instant torque, more compression=quicker/bigger torque throughout te band, where as those big ol cams move the torque/hp up the revs ALOT. Which is great at the strip, but can be a pain on the street.

Texas speed is great, but also check out vengeance racing. They have a ton of ls experience as well and great service. I'd also spend some time over on ls1tech and do some more research there
Well... like I said before, I'm shooting for reliability and driveability first. It will see some racing, but doesn't need to be a big breather -

I'm seriously realizing how lost I am in this side of engine builds.. I like the idea of fast throttle response and insta-torque, I don't want a stupid lopy idle (though they do sound cool).. Where would I start lookin' into the 5.3 heads? Is there any market for the stock LS1 heads? Sheesh so many questions!!
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Old 09-09-2013, 08:22 PM   #24
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While I applaud anything LSx swapped, the baddest grocery getter ever is a LSx 427 E39 wagon...

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...hlight=e39+427





http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=VYDsb_psRO0&fs=1" width="644" height="390">http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=VYDsb_psRO0&fs=1" />Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly. Click here to see how YouTube videos should be embedded. There could also be a technical issue that's not your fault. Click http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=VYDsb_psRO0" target="_blank">here to view the video on YouTube's site. If this link doesn't work, you did something wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=FRweI8-SV4k&fs=1" width="644" height="390">http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=FRweI8-SV4k&fs=1" />Something went wrong. Please make sure you added the video correctly. Click here to see how YouTube videos should be embedded. There could also be a technical issue that's not your fault. Click http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=FRweI8-SV4k" target="_blank">here to view the video on YouTube's site. If this link doesn't work, you did something wrong.


Good luck with your project!
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Old 09-09-2013, 10:28 PM   #25
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^ Here is the full thread:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...-swap-project/

That's an awesome car, but I can't wait to see the E46 touring.
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Old 09-10-2013, 07:32 AM   #26
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Quote:
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^ Here is the full thread:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...-swap-project/

That's an awesome car, but I can't wait to see the E46 touring.
I've been following that thread - 'Tis a good one... There is a clip somewhere in the thread that someone caught of him driving around or through a McDonalds or Dairy queen or something... Sounds gnarly..

I have a bookmarks link folder (shopping list) and a rolling budget worksheet (starting to get scary) - I can't wait to start into the goodies
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Old 09-10-2013, 12:11 PM   #27
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Is this your first foray into GM Pushrod Power ?
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Old 09-10-2013, 12:17 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by POS VETT View Post
Is this your first foray into GM Pushrod Power ?
Does it show?

Yes. Very yes.

I am super familiar with the M50/BMW's straight 6s... and being an engineer I understand the idea of tolerancing...

But as far as building an engine to meet a rough power goal while trying to learn and sift through all the lingo... what works with what, proven combinations... Yikes.. I've spent a few hours reading on the subject, and so far it's looking like the setup will involve a set of 5.3 ported/polished heads, FAST intake (92mm?), and a .520+ lift cam? I think? I haven't really gotten into the cams yet..

Would it be a wise choice to go with a package deal that someone offers between heads/cam?
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Old 09-10-2013, 07:05 PM   #29
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From your wants/needs... Idk if a 500hp stock cube setup would be anything near a reliable daily. At the crank yes, all day long. I'd say a h/c/I motor is all you'd want, and even then keep it a mild cam.
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:37 PM   #30
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I've been exploring some alternate methods of horsepower this past week or two..

I need to decide how much room there is under the E46 ///M front hood in the area of intake manifold/throttle body -

If I can fit it, I'd like to stuff a Magnuson Heart Beat Supercharger setup on the engine, and step backwards to a very conservative setup.. should drastically improve chances for a ~500hp (at the wheels) reliable setup..



Truth be told though, I'm not confident it will fit - I don't want to go hood cowl either.. that is just not and option.
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:44 PM   #31
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procharger is all you need if you want to boost it.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:49 AM   #32
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So I've put in a little bit of work - Started getting the engine taken care of..

Separated the tranny and tucked the wiring harness(es) into a box..

So to my pleasant surprise, I found what I believe to be a brand new clutch and a lightweight SFi spec flywheel-

Trying to identify exactly what this is... anyone have a clue?















I can only hope when I pull the rest of the engine apart that it has some other goodies in it

---------- Post added at 08:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:44 AM ----------

Actually - Google will never lead you astray -

Looks like it was one of these kits:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LuK-Pro-Gold...p2054897.l4276

Anyone have any experience with these? Worth keeping or ditch in favor of something new/trusted?
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Old 10-16-2013, 11:54 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by owndjoo View Post
From your wants/needs... Idk if a 500hp stock cube setup would be anything near a reliable daily. At the crank yes, all day long. I'd say a h/c/I motor is all you'd want, and even then keep it a mild cam.
Wouldn't need to be a DD, just once a week to get the groceries!
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Old 10-16-2013, 07:29 PM   #34
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How is 500hp from a LS not reliable?
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Old 11-11-2013, 08:00 AM   #35
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It's been a while since I've put anything up here..

Met with a good friend who does a lot of LS tuning for a living - Considering side stepping into something with a 4" bore instead of the LS1.. Looking at the L76 primarily (6.0L, Aluminum). The trick is going to be finding one that is priced at the same point as what I could get out of my LS1..

That aside, I've also picked up the vehicle. I give you the wagon.


It's a 2003 Sport package wagon... Auto at the moment, but who cares - price was definitely right. No rust, great paint, HK sound and sport package.. Mystic Metallic Blue is the color. The car was originally a Florida car, then Georgia... then Tennessee. Picked it up from a small used car dealer in Murfreesboro on Saturday (Was only listed 1 day before I got to it )..

Now to get to workin' more seriously on that engine! (and cleaning out my 3rd bay)..
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:32 AM   #36
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Sexy!

When are we taking the engine out? I'll make sure ground straps are attached before we crank
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Old 11-11-2013, 12:00 PM   #37
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...Also forgot to mention - Was so flustered/warm fuzzy this morning when I was leaving because I got to drive it again that I left my lunch on the counter.

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Old 11-11-2013, 09:20 PM   #38
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Are you against the LQ4/9 iron block? Only about 80lb difference, MUCH stronger, and easily had. An LS2 is going to be same price as an L76 being such a new platform as well.
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Old 11-12-2013, 09:27 AM   #39
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Are you against the LQ4/9 iron block? Only about 80lb difference, MUCH stronger, and easily had. An LS2 is going to be same price as an L76 being such a new platform as well.
Not really opposed to that route... but I plan to corner carve with this beast at some point... so adding additional weight over the front wheels is less than desired Edit: I can't find any good info on the factory corner weights of a sport wagon to start.. I've got a buddy with some scales, so I'll roll it up to see how it sits right now.. If it's heavy in the back then I may be willing to take on some extra weight to meet the 50/50 (in which case it may be beneficial)

The M54 weighs in at 375lbs.. An LS1 is roughly 400 I think? I'm fairly certain that the ideal 50/50 weight split is already biased towards the front in most cases, so adding an additional 80 lbs over the 25 (which could account for a ~3.2% shift) just makes me go meh..

That all said, I'm really considering just staying LS1 purely because I already own it.. This could potentially limit my boost options down the road to something that doesn't mount in lieu of the intake manifold...

Full disclosure - The guy I've been speaking with about the engine plan is Mike from Proxses Tuning... (whom is tuning yours, yes?) - I also haven't even been able to find an L76 for sale to get a benchmark price point to compare against the potential "sale price" of an LS1.. Mike tells me I should be able to either side step for little to no additional investment, or I'll even make money if I can find one.. This is proving to be the hardest part..
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Old 11-14-2013, 09:24 AM   #40
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So the wagon went on the scales yesterday -

For anyone interested, here's how it shakes out for 100% stock 2003 325iT with an almost full tank of gas (Power everything, Rear trunk screen, HK Sound system etc.) (~50 miles or less on the tank).

No Driver, Full Tank:


LEFT: 1765 (50.02%)
REAR: 1861 (52.74%)
CROSS: 1840 (52.15%)
TOTAL: 3528 BITE: 77

LF: 796 RF: 870
LR: 969 RR: 892
CROSS: 1839 (52.14%)


Driver (190lbs), Full Tank:


LEFT: 1920 (51.43%)
REAR: 1967 (52.69%)
CROSS: 1937 (51.93%)
TOTAL: 3730 BITE: 124

LF: 874 RF: 891
LR: 1046 RR: 919
CROSS: 1937 (51.93%)

What's interesting, is the fuel tank is either right between the wheels, or just aft of. From what I can find, we'll chalk the fuel tank size up to 16.5 Gallons with a ~2 gallon reserve (when your light comes on). At 6.073lb/USGal, half a tank (indicated) would give you a 45lb swing.. Not a ton... but that's enough to swing the weight balance from 52.69% rear to roughly 51.49%.. Which, theorizing an empty tank (on reserve) being a 90lb swing.. actually brings the back end to the light side at 49.48%. All this means nothing unless you consider the potential engine weight we're talking about adding -

The LS1 is +25lbs over factory (so google tells me).. The LQ4/LQ90 is ~ +105lbs over factory. All that said, let's assume you add the 105lbs to the front. With a full tank of gas, you'd have a rear weight of somewhere around 1937lbs over a vehicle weight of 3838lbs. Voila. 50.46%
Ok, so here's the part that I hadn't considered up until last night.. The supercharger setup would weigh in at roughly 125lbs. That swings it back to 48.87%/51.13% (Rear/Front). Not really that bad! All things said and done, the extra weight up front will not be a detrimental adder to the vehicle..

May be time to start seriously looking at an LQ4/9?
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